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In entrepreneurship — and especially for women in business — self doubt can be one of the biggest things that holds you back from your success. Self doubt slayer Renae Saager shares how to tune into yourself and rely on your self trust to find motivation and success in business.

While Renae Saager got her start helping women reshape their relationship to food and body — now, her work is so much more. Every day, she helps powerful, smart women finally release their iron grip on their appearance, self-sabotage, and desire to please... and step into the most badass, ballsy version of themselves, so they can start eating, moving, dressing, and loving life the way THEY truly want and deserve to.

Website // Instagram

The episode:

Katrina Widener: Hello everyone and welcome back to the Badass Business Squad podcast. It is your host Katrina Widener. I am very excited because today I am here with Renae Saager and we are going to be diving into a lot of that self-doubt/mindset/ overwhelmed type of everyday things that happen when you're an entrepreneur. So thank you so much Renae for being here.

Renae Saager: Yeah, thank you! I'm excited to chat with you. 

Katrina Widener: Yes. So, okay. Before we dive into today's topic, I was hoping that you wouldn't mind kicking us off with just a little introduction of who you are and what your business is.

Renae Saager: Yeah. I'm a ballsy life strategist and confidence coach for entrepreneurs that want to stop people pleasing and overthinking and start going balls out on the life that they love. I'm really kind of stoked on this demographic of women because it's this individual that feels almost kind of blocked. It's like a glass wall and it's like, "Ugh. Like I just want to get past this. I just want to show up more. I just want to not care so damn much about what everyone thinks." But they kinda like bump up against that wall and revert back to their old ways. So we get to kind of completely demolish that and recreate how they want to be showing up and ultimately how they want to be running their business. 

Katrina Widener: That's a great way to describe it. I could even imagine myself at times, like that glass wall for me, right? I feel like everyone knows exactly what you're talking about. 

Renae Saager: Mm-hmm.

Katrina Widener: Where there's these things that I want to do or this way that I want to show up for myself and yet it's almost like. "Whoop just walked right into that wall again." 

Renae Saager: Yep. 

Katrina Widener: Because I'm like just imagining boom, like walking straight into that. But I can definitely see how it affects people and I see it all the time with my clients, so it makes so much sense to focus in on that.

Renae Saager: Mm-hmm. 

Katrina Widener: So when it comes to like helping women reshape their relationship really to themselves, and reimagine that glass wall and kind of break through that, where do you start with your clients? Like what is like the first thing that you get started with? 

Renae Saager: Well, usually so much comes out in our just initial consultation or just our first call in working together. Because even if someone comes to me and they're like, "I just, I don't even know. I don't even know what I want," and then we kind of talk through it a little bit? It always ends up coming out, or at least kind of like this stepping stone in the direction that they want to be going. It's not an overnight kind of shift thing, right?

So we get that first stepping stone and then we just kind of build off of it, and what I find almost always happens is it's like a snowball going downhill. Like maybe the first couple times you're like, "I don't know. Is this right? Does this work? I'm not sure, blah, blah, blah." But then you really start kind of coming into yourself and you're like, "Oh hell yeah!" and it's like just momentum, momentum, momentum, and you finally kind of drop all that just dead weight that you've been carrying and you step into your own and you're like, "I can't believe I used to think that way. I can't believe I used to not do these things," right? 

Because it's... not to undermine what people are feeling, but like it's made up. It's in our brains, and this is always with women that are like way more qualified than they need to be. So incredible, so talented. Like some of my clients I'm like, "Oh my God, I can't believe you want to work with me." Because they're so cool. But in their brains they're like, "I don't know. Do I belong here? Or is anyone going to want this? What if they don't like me? What are they going to think?" 

So it's, you know, as we kind of find that first stepping stone, we start building off that. And then they really get clear on exactly who they are and how they want to be showing up for themselves. Or something that I always say is "Unpucker your pooper," because they just need to relax a little bit more. They're often real controlling like, "Okay, it has to be this way. It has to be this way!" And so it's just, "Oh, I get to enjoy the ride and hit off these goals, and it doesn't have to be perfect. Let's roll." and it's just so much more. 

Katrina Widener: Everything that you're talking about are things that I'm just like, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. Because this is what I love to talk about and I've talked about for years is this idea of like, entrepreneurship can feel fun. It doesn't have to be this struggle. It doesn't have to be this hustle, and when we can really like figure out what is going on in our heads that's really like the self-sabotage? Mindset is 80% of success if not more honestly. 

Renae Saager: Mm-hmm. 

Katrina Widener: Because what's actually getting us in the way of being successful is not, "I need to learn that new tactic or I need to like figure out this new strategy."

Renae Saager: Yeah.

Katrina Widener: It's all what's happening in your mind and how you're holding yourself back, and I talk a lot about community and the power of community and the power of feeling like you belong. So I really love that you mentioned that as well. Just this idea of like, "Do I belong here?" Like the comparing yourself to other people, because I feel like that's oftentimes what actually holds us back more than anything else. Really the noise in our heads.

Which I know you and I were talking about before we started recording too, of just this like overwhelming noise and so many sources and all of these people having opinions, instead of just trusting yourself. So I was wondering if you wouldn't mind kind of speaking to that a little bit as well.

Renae Saager: Yes, and I love that you brought up community too because I have a Ballsy Broads group, and we talked about this on our call yesterday. Because all the women in this group, they're already entrepreneurs or they're making a shift from corporate to entrepreneurship, or they're just like incredible. All of them, every time I run a group someone will say, "Wow, I can't believe she's in this group, she seems so put together. Like she seems like everything's just going well." And it's like, "Yeah, she still has a pulse, like she still a human being." We can sit and doubt ourselves and stay in that trench for literally our entire lives. Or we make a very conscious effort to step out. 

So that is a thing that I often, you know, suggest to clients is that sometimes I think we think it's supposed to be really easy. Like it should just naturally happen and we should just flow into this state of just not caring. And it's like, "No, you gotta decide on that shit every single day in the beginning. You have to kind of recommit to that every single day, and then yes, eventually It becomes your new normal. You create a new baseline for yourself." And to start getting there, we have to stop crowdsourcing all of our answers. 

And listen, this is hard. I was even thinking this morning in the shower, how over the last several years that I've been been in business, how many coaches and entrepreneurs I used to follow because I really felt like I needed it. It was like my life jacket. Like, "Okay, what is she doing? Okay, she's running a group like that. This is how much she's charging. Okay. Oh my gosh, her template looks so good, I should do that."

And how it's shifted dramatically to now I was like, "Oh my gosh, I don't follow her at all anymore and I used to be obsessed over her content." But when we do that we're essentially telling ourselves, "Hey, your ideas suck. Whatever you want to do isn't going to be good enough. It's definitely not going to work. Let's go copy her."

And listen, 90% of the time "her" isn't actually as maybe successful as you think she is. She's just... she's just doing it. She's just showing up. But we paint these stories in our head, and so the more that you can kind of constrain to like a couple people. Because I do that as well, it's good to get ideas and be inspired. But really try to bring it back to you and shut out a lot of that noise because... this is something my boyfriend said to me. Well, he's now my fiance, which is fun. But he said this to me. 

Katrina Widener: Ooh! 

Renae Saager: Yeah! He said this to me a few years ago when I was kind of going through my own shit, and he's like, "Renae, Brene Brown already exists. We don't need another Brene Brown. She's here, she's crushing. Great. Love her. We don't need another Oprah Winfrey." It's like really starting to take your steak and do it your way, because that's what makes people stand out. That's what makes a difference. I mean, I'm sure everyone can relate to where you scroll online and you're like, "Jesus, I've seen this quote 48 times. Like, who cares?"

Katrina Widener: Mm-hmm.

Renae Saager: You know? And it's all just this vanilla regurgitated blah, and we get rid of that by coming into our own. It is scary because every single person has a fear of rejection. That's the price you pay to get to where you want to go.

Katrina Widener: Yes, yes, yes, yes. Again! I love that you also mentioned like coaching relationships or people that you're following on social media. Because as a coach when I work with my clients, it's really about guiding them to make their own decisions, to figure out what works for them. Having it be their flair, their personality, or their take on whatever it is that they're doing, and how do we get it as aligned as possible at their natural selves. 

Renae Saager: Mm-hmm.

Katrina Widener: And I feel like so often in the entrepreneur industry, we're being taught to "Do it my way, do it my way, do it my way. Take my course and learn how I did this or work with me so you can get the same results that I did."

Renae Saager: Mm-hmm. 

Katrina Widener: And I almost feel like it feeds into this narrative of, "I need to look outside of myself for the answers."

Renae Saager: Mm-hmm.

Katrina Widener: Whereas when you're in these true relationships, whether that's a coaching relationship or a network of people that are supporting you. Ideally what you're looking for are people who are encouraging and emphasizing what makes you you, as opposed to how you can operate like somebody else's.

Renae Saager: Mm-hmm. 

Katrina Widener: I'm so glad that you brought that up because I want also for everyone listening to take note of that and to ask yourselves like, "Who are the people that I'm following so that I can in a way continue to tell myself that my ideas are wrong." Which also if we just think about what that does to your mind over time? If you are consistently following people who you're like, "I should do it their way," or you're working with people who are saying, "You should do it this way." Or you're in community with people who are saying, "You should do it this way." That means you are regularly showing up in places and on a consistent basis telling your own brain that you are wrong. 

Renae Saager: Mm-hmm. 

Katrina Widener: That you are doing things wrong. That's such a toxic place for our brains to stay in! Ugh! 

Renae Saager: I mean it's an abusive relationship, right? 

Katrina Widener: With yourself. 

Renae Saager: It breaks you down. Yeah, exactly. 

Katrina Widener: Yes, 100%. Oh my gosh. Okay, so for everyone who is just sitting here like, "Okay guys, I hear you. You're making some points that maybe I didn't think of beforehand." Where would you recommend people get started breaking away from this or stepping into like their ballsy selves, right? 

Renae Saager: Yeah! Yeah, I love this. So it's going to be... it's going to be a little bit different for everyone. But I think most people know when they feel most themselves. We all have different personalities, right? Like I was sitting on the couch last night, it was like nine o'clock and I was having a bowl of cereal cause I was hungry before bed. And I was just thinking about like my personality at 9:00 PM with my partner, you know, watching TV versus my personality online working with my clients, like in business mode. So I would encourage the listeners to find the time or the space in their day or their life where they really do tap into that true, true self.

So for me, I'll give you an example, it's after I have a cup of coffee or two and then I go for a run. Doesn't have to be long. Because my brain is like all over the place and so I do better when I'm moving, like more stuff comes into my mind. And that's when I get all these great ideas and I'll sometimes even have an audio book on in the background. It doesn't matter because it gets just my brain going. But that's when I'm like, "Fuck yeah, this is the idea. This is what I want to do. This is what stokes my fire. This is what lights me up." and then run with that. Trust that. Do not think it to death. You will think and you will think, and you will talk yourself out of every single incredible idea that you have ever had, because that logical brain's going to be like, "No, that's never going to work. No one's going to come. No one's going to want that. Who do you think you are?" And it's like, you know what? You may be right. Let's find out. 

I mean, I feel that every time I make a launch! It's like, "No one's going to come. No one's going to come." People always come! People always come. So I would say like kind of what we've already talked about, like really being particular about where your energy is going. You know, how many people you're following on social media. How many emails you're getting from other coaches or entrepreneurs telling you all this stuff. Like just really make sure it's how you want to be spending your time and how you want to be consuming your information. And unfollowing and unsubscribing from people doesn't mean you don't like them.

Katrina Widener: Yes! 

Renae Saager: Like, I love people that I unsubscribe from all of the time, and I do I worry. I'm like, "Oh my gosh, is she going to know? Is she going to go in and look that I was an unsubscribe?" But I'm like, "Well, she has to deal with that." I love her but I just... it messes with my own brain.

So like really constrain how much you're consuming from all of these other sources, and then two, figure out what it is that makes you feel most like you. For some people it might be doing pottery. For some people it might be working out. For other people it might be nine o'clock at night when they're in bed and they're writing in their journal. For other people it might be listening to a motivational TED talk. Like, I don't know! I don't care if you have to jump up and down on one foot and drink ice water naked, like if that's what gets you there, do it! Do your own thing, like find your own habits and ways and routines that really make things click for you.

And then most importantly, go out and do it. I don't care how great your ideas are. I don't care how talented you are, I don't care how brilliant you are. If you don't get out there nothing's going to happen. This is a huge differentiator between people that are making it and people that are hoping to one day make it. Is like, "Who's taking action?" anyone can post once a day on social media, twice a day.Who cares? Who's putting on like a good freebie? Who's giving out great content? Who's getting on people's podcasts? Who's showing up to events? Rubber meets the road here. 

Katrina Widener: Yes, yes! It's so interesting because I think so often when we are sitting on like, say Instagram, right? Or sitting in our email inboxes and we're getting this stuff from people. I'm at the point now where I honestly am barely on my Instagram account anymore. I will go in every day. I will check. I might post, I might say like, "Here's the new podcast episode for the week." Or I might share some behind the scenes stuff. But the way that I used to sit on Instagram and be like, "I'm going to get inspired. I'm going to look at these things." It doesn't feel inspiring anymore, it feels like noise. It feels like it's adding this like background static to my life as opposed to giving me any clarity or inspiration or things to respond to. And so I have just naturally chosen not to do that as much anymore. 

My email inbox? I think I'm subscribed to one other coach. That's it. And it's my coach, right? 

Renae Saager: Mm-hmm.

Katrina Widener: It's like the person who I have paid to work with because I love working with her so much. And even then I will say, "This is a helpful email going to save that, watch these videos, or come to this event later. This one's not going to, delete it. Move on with my life." Having that ability to edit where we're taking in information is actually super powerful. Like you said it is an abusive relationship that we're in with ourselves when we're constantly saying all this stuff to ourselves.

I love that you were mentioning taking stock of like when we feel most like ourselves or when we like ourselves the most. But also paying attention to when we are letting that voice in our head be talking to us all the time and saying, "How do I do less of this?"

Renae Saager: Mm-hmm. 

Katrina Widener: Because if we're doing more of the one? Maybe let's also say, "Is it when I'm on Instagram that I'm constantly hearing this voice in my head saying, 'I should be doing better, or I can't be doing it like she does it, or this isn't going to be successful,' and editing those out as well." Because, ugh your brain is so important. 

Renae Saager: Yeah, and you mentioned you used to also follow a lot and now you don't and it brought something up to my mind and then this comes back to self-trust too; really honoring the seasons that you're in, in your life, in your business. Because you are going to go through... I guess I can maybe only speak for myself. I know that I go through six months to a year where I'm like, "If I have to listen to one more self-help book, I'm going to run into oncoming traffic. Like I just can't, I'm so over it." And then other times where I'm like signing up for events, I'm bingeing on episodes. Other times I'm just going out in silence.

Other times it's a Spotify playlist. And so it's really just, "You know what? This is where I'm at. I'm at the place where I'm unsubscribing. I'm unfollowing. I'm not on social media. It's not feeding me the way that it used to, and this is just where I'm at." Instead of, "Well, I should, why can't I? What's wrong with me? Is my inspiration gone? Am I not motivated anymore? Am I not dedicated anymore?" It's like, "Oh my gosh, no. You're just evolving as a person and a business owner. That's it!" 

Katrina Widener: Right! I get so... I don't know. It's like a visceral reaction for me too, of the "shoulds". 

Renae Saager: Mm-hmm.

Katrina Widener: Of like, "Ugh, no I don't. Don't 'should' on yourself!" And the thing that I always get stuck on is why as humans... actually, I know why. 

Renae Saager: Mm-hmm. 

Katrina Widener: But why as humans do we really think that "shoulds" are going to get us... this thing that feels terrible, this thing that like you get a bodily response when you're trying to force yourself to do something. 

Renae Saager: Mm-hmm.

Katrina Widener: And you're like, "But that's the thing that's going to make this successful!"

Renae Saager: Yep. It's like we're just a bunch of masochists just running around. 

Katrina Widener: Exactly. 

Renae Saager: Yeah I mean...

Katrina Widener: Little too real, but yes.

Renae Saager: Yeah. 

Katrina Widener: Okay, so for everyone who are listening and are like, "This is so helpful. I agree with everything you guys are saying. I'm going to maybe start looking at these areas where I like myself, look at these areas where I don't like myself when I'm in them."

Renae Saager: Mm-hmm.

Katrina Widener: What would you say would be like your last piece of advice for them? As you're going through trying to figure this out, keep this in mind.

Renae Saager: Well, you're going to doubt it. You're going to think it's a terrible idea. So keep that in mind. That you're going to be like, "This is not the like..." yes, that's coming. You're not going to be like completely 100% backingyour idea the whole way through. You know, this is where I do think having, like you said, your business coach that you've paid, you love, you trust.

I do think it is really helpful to have someone else on your side that gets you, and can hold that vision. Because you will waiver, you will freak out, you will think it's a bad idea. And we all need someone that kind of keeps our feet to the fire and is like, "Go do your thing. I'll be here when you're ready. This is a great idea. We're seeing this through, this is incredible." And like giving yourself that permission to be human, but also having someone like reel you back in when you kind of go through those spin outs. 

Katrina Widener: Yes, yes. Having your personal hype person is what I like to call them.

Renae Saager: Yeah, yeah!

Katrina Widener: Yes, okay. Well, thank you so much for coming on. This has been absolutely amazing. The very last thing to end on is just where can people find you if they're interested in connecting after they listen?

Renae Saager: Yeah, I'm most active on Instagram at @renaesaager. Or you can also find me on my website. I have my offers and more about me and how I work with clients on there, which is also www.renaesaager.com. 

Katrina Widener: Perfect. Thank you so much for coming on, this has been a lot of fun. 

Renae Saager: Yeah, thank you. Thanks for having me!

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